[RP22]

Hello, I would appreciate, please, input on something that happened in our ’19 reg SEL T-Roc, yesterday the 19th: We were driving in a country lane, about 35 mph. There was a car about 20 metres in front, a car behind. Nothing coming the other way. No animals on the road. No vegetation creeping onto the road. All of a sudden, without any warning, the T-Roc slammed its brakes on, and stopped dead with 2 or 3 metres. A bright red car outline came up on the display. It was absolutely shocking. The car behind jammed its brakes on, and just managed to avoid a shunt.

There was absolutely nothing unusual about the driving situation. After a few moments the red car outline disappeared, and we were able to drive away. To say that it has thrown us is an understatement. The car behind was able to stop, but what if we had been, for example, in a busy motorway lane? The car is fully serviced, and I have asked the garage to look at this on the coming Friday. I have looked at the forums, there are a few references but nothing as frightening as what happened yesterday. The car literally stopped, on the spot, in the middle of the road. If we had been shunted, or someone hurt, whose fault would it have been legally? Does the car keep a record of emergency stops in its computer?

If you have had experience of this, I would like to hear about it. Any constructive comments are always welcome.

 

[Impala]

The sudden braking you describe is invoked by the front assist systems, which use the front facing camera, ACC radar and parking distance sensors.

Sometimes, especially on country roads and on bends, the system is activated by sensing an obstruction or movement on the nearside verge, which the car wrongly believes is a pedestrian, animal or other vehicle about to come into collision with the car. Maybe there was something which you didn't notice, so it did the job it was intended to do, but sometimes one or more of the sensors can be impaired or confused by rain, snow, dirt or a piece of litter.

The workshop should be able to examine the logs to determine if there are any recurring sensor faults, but I doubt if they can actually test them in real life conditions. Not sure if the emergency braking is recorded, with a reason, especially if there was no collision and airbags weren't activated.

 

[Tricky2]

Best you can do is set the emergency braking to LATE.

 

[chips]

Hello, I would appreciate, please, input on something that happened in our ’19 reg SEL T-Roc, yesterday the 19th: We were driving in a country lane, about 35 mph. There was a car about 20 metres in front, a car behind. Nothing coming the other way. No animals on the road. No vegetation creeping onto the road. All of a sudden, without any warning, the T-Roc slammed its brakes on, and stopped dead with 2 or 3 metres. A bright red car outline came up on the display. It was absolutely shocking. The car behind jammed its brakes on, and just managed to avoid a shunt.

There was absolutely nothing unusual about the driving situation. After a few moments the red car outline disappeared, and we were able to drive away. To say that it has thrown us is an understatement. The car behind was able to stop, but what if we had been, for example, in a busy motorway lane? The car is fully serviced, and I have asked the garage to look at this on the coming Friday. I have looked at the forums, there are a few references but nothing as frightening as what happened yesterday. The car literally stopped, on the spot, in the middle of the road. If we had been shunted, or someone hurt, whose fault would it have been legally? Does the car keep a record of emergency stops in its computer?

If you have had experience of this, I would like to hear about it. Any constructive comments are always welcome.

I'm sure you've probably seen this?

Volkswagens Needlessly Brake on Their Own Due to Defects in the Front Assist Technology

VW's collision avoidance technology is detecting objects that don't exist. When that happens it slams on the brakes and ends up putting unsuspecting occupants in harm's way. A lawsuit wants the automaker to do more than simply suggest that owners turn the premium feature off.

www.vwproblems.com

 

[Impala]

Why does the UK government think driverless cars are ready for use on our roads ? Do they think the 'technology' is infallible and 'computer' is always right ?

I don't believe such problems with front assist etc. are limited to VW.

 

[twist]

Why does the UK government think driverless cars are ready for use on our roads ? Do they think the 'technology' is infallible and 'computer' is always right ?

I don't believe such problems with front assist etc. are limited to VW.

Oh definitely not. The problems happen on the other car brands too. There was an AutoTrader video a few months ago on the topic, debating whether or not this stuff actually does anything to help with safety.

The thing is: it’s always going to be like this. I’ve said this before but these systems are reading what is essentially “analog” data rather than digital so there will always be a degree of false-positives. Software can advance and we can use technologies like machine learning to try and make software “smarter” and think more like a human but ultimately it’s still just an algorithm making a decision with imperfect data. And it’s very dangerous that people rely on these things rather than use them as assistance systems as they are intended.

I must admit: my T-Roc very rarely does this - even in traffic jams - but for the few times that it has genuinely caught a slam of the brakes ahead before I have (while I’m trying to change lanes or something), I appreciate the system being there to alert me.

 

[peterh]

Why does the UK government think driverless cars are ready for use on our roads ? Do they think the 'technology' is infallible and 'computer' is always right ?

I don't believe such problems with front assist etc. are limited to VW.

Does anyone really think the British government is competent at anything ?
When you have Boris etc. Every one of them was born with a silver spoon in every orifice they have.
Not one of them lives in our world, but they have some how got themselves into a position where they dictate our lives. They didn’t get where they are by being nice people.

 

[RP22]

Just to wind this one up, I have had the car in the garage, and they have not been able to find anything wrong. I was also told that the on-board systems have not recorded anything related to this incident. A positive is that (after having to ask for it) I now have a piece of paper from the garage summing up what happened, what they have checked, and that nothing was wrong. I can see a situation in the future where having that piece of paper is important. The negative news is that the next time I'm in the outside lane on the motorway, I don't know how I personally will feel safety-wise. I thank everyone who has made useful contributions.

 

[Impala]

These "now you see it, now you don't" issues are the worst to deal with. There is no trail of evidence of a fault, but the car didn't behave as you would expect or want and you might go weeks, months or longer and it never happens again, which isn't reassuring.

Even if your car exhibited the same reaction with one of the workshop engineers driving, they probably wouldn't be any further forward if there are no fault codes logged. In those circumstances, they would either pretend it never happened or would start replacing components and sub-systems on a trial and error basis, but if it doesn't happen frequently, how would you/they ever know if it was fixed ?

I have a similar problem just now with my Mib2 Sat Nav, where all the street and place names disappear from the map and the zoom function doesn't work properly. It has done it 3 or 4 times at random intervals over the past month but I can't reproduce it at will. The car is a month past warranty end, but I reported this a couple of weeks ago (just after my service) and the car is booked in to the workshop but, like yours, I don't think they will find any fault.

 

[Vernerbongo2]

car is a month past warranty end, but I reported this a couple of weeks ago (just after my service) and the car is booked in to the workshop but, like yours, I don't think they will find any fault.

What's your software version?
The most recent & last update is version 0879. (assuming our MIB2 is the same)

Maybe you could ask for a software update, if you aren't already on the latest version?

Very strange this fault hasn't been present until lately though 🤔

What about a reset, holding in the on/off button until the MIB reboots although I think the system reboots when you turn it on anyway?
A factory reset via the menu although you'll have to personalise the whole system again?

Obviously the workshop is your first port of call 👌

 

[Impala]

What's your software version?
...
What about a reset, holding in the on/off button until the MIB reboots
...
A factory reset via the menu
...
Obviously the workshop is your first port of call 👌

Looks like my hardware and software are a higher version to yours Vernerbongo2

I've already tried the MIB power button reset several times ... no effect
As for factory reset, that's a last resort but the workshop may or may not do that.

The car was due to go in to the dealer next week, but the problem hadn't recurred in 3-4 weeks, so I thought the workshop visit would be pointless and result in no fault found. So I cancelled the appointment 3 days ago, and guess what ... the problem happened again the following morning, and this time much more was affected. It started working again after a few hours but problem returned the next morning (yesterday).

The car is booked in to the workshop again, but I lost the appointment slot so it will be 3 weeks to wait.

Fortunately when the problem happened 3 days ago, I was able to capture a series of videos showing the multiple issues and I've put these on YouTube and sent a link to the dealer. As you probably know from my posts in another thread, I updated my maps to 1910 (v16) yesterday but I don't think that is the reason for the problem. Put the new maps into the car this morning and so far so good, but it was 3 or 4 weeks last time before the problem reappeared so it is too soon to tell.

Here's an abbreviated list of just some of the issues from 3 days ago;

• Drove 2 miles from home and parked for 2 hrs - Sat Nav working ok
• Drove home and Sat Nav was working to start with, then the street and place names disappeared.
• Switch off at home, then switched on again. Sat Nav showed my position back where I had been parked, 10 minutes earlier and 2 miles away from where I now was.
• Street names were showing, but map wouldn't zoom or pan or relocate to my current position
• 'Rocket' zoom worked but zoomed out to show half of Scotland and didn't zoom back in again.
• Map was now frozen - no zoom or pan etc. When turning the right-hand button, the scale indicator changed normally but the map didn't zoom in or out.
• Tried to switch the map to the cockpit and got a 'Starting map view' message in the cockpit but the map never appeared. Switched map back to main display bit it took about 20 seconds to appear and was still frozen.
• Tried switching off, doing the power button reset etc. and still the map was frozen.
• Left it switched off for 3 hours, then tried it and found everything was back to normal.
• When Sat Nav wasn't working, the Radio and Media functions and everything else in the Infotainment system seemed to be working normally.

 

[Vernerbongo2]

Looks like my hardware and software are a higher version to yours Vernerbongo2
View attachment 4436

I've already tried the MIB power button reset several times ... no effect
As for factory reset, that's a last resort but the workshop may or may not do that.

The car was due to go in to the dealer next week, but the problem hadn't recurred in 3-4 weeks, so I thought the workshop visit would be pointless and result in no fault found. So I cancelled the appointment 3 days ago, and guess what ... the problem happened again the following morning, and this time much more was affected. It started working again after a few hours but problem returned the next morning (yesterday).

The car is booked in to the workshop again, but I lost the appointment slot so it will be 3 weeks to wait.

Fortunately when the problem happened 3 days ago, I was able to capture a series of videos showing the multiple issues and I've put these on YouTube and sent a link to the dealer. As you probably know from my posts in another thread, I updated my maps to 1910 (v16) yesterday but I don't think that is the reason for the problem. Put the new maps into the car this morning and so far so good, but it was 3 or 4 weeks last time before the problem reappeared so it is too soon to tell.

Here's an abbreviated list of just some of the issues from 3 days ago;

• Drove 2 miles from home and parked for 2 hrs - Sat Nav working ok
• Drove home and Sat Nav was working to start with, then the street and place names disappeared.
• Switch off at home, then switched on again. Sat Nav showed my position back where I had been parked, 10 minutes earlier and 2 miles away from where I now was.
• Street names were showing, but map wouldn't zoom or pan or relocate to my current position
• 'Rocket' zoom worked but zoomed out to show half of Scotland and didn't zoom back in again.
• Map was now frozen - no zoom or pan etc. When turning the right-hand button, the scale indicator changed normally but the map didn't zoom in or out.
• Tried to switch the map to the cockpit and got a 'Starting map view' message in the cockpit but the map never appeared. Switched map back to main display bit it took about 20 seconds to appear and was still frozen.
• Tried switching off, doing the power button reset etc. and still the map was frozen.
• Left it switched off for 3 hours, then tried it and found everything was back to normal.
• When Sat Nav wasn't working, the Radio and Media functions and everything else in the Infotainment system seemed to be working normally.

Believe it or not the 0879 is the most recent software version, the version numbers are out of sequence apparently 🤔🤷‍♂️
That's why I didn't update to the 0891 version when I updated.

I have never used my sat-nav since I bought my T-Roc simply because I don't go far.
I don't know if mine works correctly or not 🤔

Funnily enough I update my sat-nav maps every year & the speed camera information every 6 months to a year 🤣😂😏

 

[Impala]

Believe it or not the 0879 is the most recent software version, the version numbers are out of sequence apparently 🤔🤷‍♂️
That's why I didn't update to the 0891 version when I updated.

Do you think the dealers know this ? Do they go by the version number, or the date ?

Any time I've asked the dealer about any available software updates when in for a service, they always tell me my car has all the updates applied. Mmmm

 

[Vernerbongo2]

Do you think the dealers know this ? Do they go by the version number, or the date ?

Any time I've asked the dealer about any available software updates when in for a service, they always tell me my car has all the updates applied. Mmmm

I was told by my local dealer they didn't like doing software updates unless the hardware/software was giving problems.
Its a pity your dealership couldn't actually show you the software version history on a computer screen.
I notice our hardware versions are different, whether that makes a difference?
The hardware number remains the same after the software update.

Unfortunately there's no way I can say this is even correct, my information is off a volkswagen MIB specialist forum.

 

[Impala]

I've seen some of that discussion before, but I wonder if it is more the case that there are h/w differences which mean s/w updates might only apply to specifiv h/w versions and that's how they apparently get out of sync. Who knows ... another VW mystery.

Thanks to my videos, there is no way they can fob me off with no fault found just because on the day the Sat Nav may work correctly, so it will be interesting to see what actions they take. I have asked for confirmation that it will be done under warranty even though my warranty expired on 20th May, just a matter of days before the first episode.

 

[Vernerbongo2]

@Impala I forgot that I could actually put any of those software versions on my unit as long as the software version started with 08, so the hardware version doesn't matter 👌